Кванмёнсон-3 (Kwangmyongsong-3) #2 - Ынха-3 - 12.12.2012 00:49 UTC - Сохэ

[Луноход]

Дмитрий В. пишет:
Вот фото 37-тонника от "Сафира-1В" - вероятно, четвертушка от ДУ Ынхи и Симурга:
 http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/ND_1.jpg

Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/ND_1.jpg on this server.

[Старый]

Дмитрий В. пишет:
Вот фото 37-тонника от "Сафира-1В" - вероятно, четвертушка от ДУ Ынхи и Симурга:
 http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/ND_1.jpg

О! Вот где хорошо показаны двигатели. 
Вечно Брюгге всё самое интересное запихивает вне основной экспозиции...

[Старый]

Луноход пишет:

Дмитрий В. пишет:
Вот фото 37-тонника от "Сафира-1В" - вероятно, четвертушка от ДУ Ынхи и Симурга:
 http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Diverse/Asian_Rocket_engines/ND_1.jpg

 
Forbidden

Вход через заглавную страницу
http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/index.htm
и там внизу справа в списке среди других : North-Korean Nodong missile family

[Штуцер]

Старый пишет:
И както смущает шарбалон на двигателе Ыхни,

Похоже, это не ШБ, а сборник мятого газа после турбины или ресивер.

[Старый]

Штуцер пишет:
Похоже, это не ШБ, а сборник мятого газа после турбины или ресивер.

А зачем такое нада?

[Штуцер]

Ресивер ставится для повышения быстродействия системы пневмоуправления (аналог конденсатора), особенно тогда, когда ШБ удалены от потребителя.

[Штуцер]

Или этот котелок, из которого выходит металлорукав выхлопной трубы:

http://f12.ifotki.info/org/7ee7d8afaa64e51e1dbc819443fd6916539509139536786.jpg

[Morin]

Salo пишет:
 

Намекаете, что двигатели скопированны с движков 8К63?

[Salo]

Это более древний экземпляр.

[Старый]

А у чучхейцев впервые в их истории новогодний фейерверк. 
 Толи шаги демократии толи победу чучхейской космонавтики празднуют...

[Lanista]

[SpaceR]

Lanista
На 260-й секунде на экране показали взрывающуюся планету Земля...  

Кстати, по сигналам от КА никаких новостей? Никто из внешнего мира их не услышал?

[Старый]

Чучхейские битлы с электроскрипками.

[Liss]

Присвоение звания Героя КНДР
Указом Президиума Верховного народного собрания № 2880 от 22 декабря 2012 г. звание Героя КНДР присвоено учёным, специалистам, рабочим, работникам, внесшим значительный вклад в успешный запуск искусственного спутника Земли "Кванмёнсон-3" № 2:

 1. Чхве Чхун Сок (최춘석)         35. Пак Хё Пхиль (박효필)        69. Ким Сун Нам (김순남)
 2. Ким Чжон Сок (김정석)       36. Хан Сын Хак (한승학)       70. Чхве Бён Ван (최병완)
 3. Ли Сон Хо (리선호)          37. Ом Чхон Хо (엄청호)        71. Ким Тхэк Гван (김택광)
 4. Хан Гым Бок (한금복)         38. Пэ Сон Чхоль (배성철)        72. Чхве И Нам (최의남)
 5. Ха Чжон Гук (하정국)          39. Чхве Ён Чжун (최영준)          73. Чон Сун Нам (정순남)
 6. Кан Бон Мо (강봉모)          40. Пэ И Гвон (배의권)           74. Мин Бён Ха (민병하)
 7. Ким Вон Иль (김원일)         41. Ом Чхан Голь (엄창걸)       75. Пак Вон Соб (박원섭)
 8. Чо Тхэ Чхоль (조태철)        42. Хан Сон Бок (한성복)       76. Ким Чжон Бок (김정복)
 9. Ян Гён Иль (양경일)        43. Чон Хак Чхоль (정학철)      77. Ким Хын Иль (김흥일)
 10. Пан Хён Чхоль (방현철)       44. Ким Чхоль Су (김철수)          78. Ли Мён Сок (리명석)
 11. Чхве Чхоль Ун (최철웅)    45. Ким Чжэ Сон (김재선)           79. Рян Тхэ Сон (량태성)
 12. Ли Се Хван (리세환)      46. Чхве Ён Чжу (최용주)           80. Ким Чхан Ун (김창운)
 13. Ким Иль Рён (김일룡)       47. Ким Дон Иль (김동일)        81. Хён Сын Гын (현승근)
 14. Ли Воль Сон (리월선)       48. Чхве Чхоль Хва (최철화)      82. Кан Ун Сон (강운성)
 15. Ким Хва Су (김화수)      49. Хо Чхоль Нам (허철남)         83. Пак Сон Хён (박성현)
 16. Пак Хён Чжон (박현종)      50. Чон Чжон Хо (정종호)       84. Ли Гван Хёк (리광혁)
 17. Ра Хо Чхоль (라호철)        51. Ан Гван Пхён (안광평)         85. Ли Гван Гук (리관국)
 18. Чхве Иль Нам (최일남)     52. Чо Ён Чхоль (조영철)          86. Ли Гук Тхэ (리국태)
 19. Чан Гён Хва (장경화)        53. Рю Мён Гым (류명금)          87. Пак Сон Чхун (박성춘)
 20. Хён Бён Хо (현병호)       54. Рю Сан Хун (류상훈)           88. Ю Чхоль У (유철우)
 21. Ким Чхан Рок (김창록)         55. Пхё Нам (표 남)            89. Ким Док Су (김덕수)
 22. Чон Чхан Нам (전창남)     56. Ли Чжан Рёль (리장렬)       90. Хан Гын Ик (한근익)
 23. Чан Гван Чхоль (장광철)   57. Ким Чхун (김 춘)          91. Ли Рён (리 룡)
 24. Ким Хо Чхоль (김호철)     58. Чон Мён Чхоль (정명철)   92. Хам Чхан Чжун (함창준)
 25. Чхве Сон Иль (최성일)     59. Хан Док Хи (한덕희)          93. Соль Чхун Гын (설충근)
 26. Пак Сон Рён (박성룡)       60. Хо Юн Чхоль (허윤철)         94. Ким Хён Су (김현수)
 27. Хван И Сон (황의송)         61. Чан Хо Вон (장호원)            95. Ли Се Хва (리세화)
 28. Ким Иль Су (김일수)        62. Рим Хо (림 호)               96. Кан Сон Гун (강성군)
 29. Ли Хын Гон (리흥건)         63. Пан Сын Чхоль (방승철)      97. Пён Чжон Сик (변정식)
 30. Ли Ён Хо (리영호)         64. Ким Ён Тхэк (김영택)        98. Рим Хён Иль (림현일)
 31. Ким Чхан Гиль (김창길)      65. Ким Сын Гиль (김승길)        99. Ким Мён Голь (감명걸)
 32. Ким Сан Гын (김상근)         66. Им Ван Чхоль (임왕철)     100. Чан Чхан Ха (장창하)
 33. Мун Сан Гын (문상근)      67. Чан Сын Нам (장승남)      101. Кан Гван Иль (강관일)
 34. Ан Дон Чхоль (안동철)       68. Ли Сон Чжон (리성전)
 
Источник:
http://mar12.livejournal.com/155988.html

[Liss]

Однако, циклограмма:



(левый и правый столбцы экрана)

[PIN]

SpaceR пишет:
Никто из внешнего мира их не услышал?

Исключительно из потустороннего. Судя по всему. Увы.

[Salo]

http://www.avanturist.org/redirect?url=http%3A%2F%2Fallthingsnuclear.org%2Fsouth-koreas-analysis-of-north-koreas-rocket-debris%2F

South Korea's Analysis of North Korea's Rocket Debris

David Wright, co-director and senior scientist

January 25, 2013

South Korea recently released a short summary (in Korean) of its analysis of the pieces it recovered of North Korea's first stage fr om its Dec. 11 satellite launch. Parts of the analysis have been showing up in the South Korean press in the last few days.



Here is a translation that I did of that summary (with the help of Google and a student who wants to remain anonymous). Corrections from readers are welcomed.

Much of what is in the analysis is already known from previous reports. The first stage of North Korea's Unha rocket uses Scud propellant—a fuel that is essentially kerosene with an oxidizer of red fuming nitric acid. It is powered by a cluster of four Nodong engines. The body is made out of an aluminum-magnesium alloy and shows relatively crude construction.

Two findings are particularly interesting. The first is that the first stage was steered not by jet vanes like the Scud and Nodong; jet vanes stick into the rocket exhaust and turn to divert some of the thrust. Instead the analysis states the Unha first stage uses four small "auxiliary engines," sometimes called "vernier engines," that can turn to add thrust in different directions and thus change the direction of the thrust enough to steer the rocket. Signals from the rocket's guidance system  could be used either to rotate jet vanes or these small steering engines.


Figure 1. Nodong missile with one of the four jet vanes circled.

The existence of these small engines is not a surprise, since they are what we have assumed North Korea used to power the Unha third stage, but no one knew they were used in the first stage.

Adding these auxiliary engines to the cluster of four Nodong engines makes the propulsion system more complicated. But this steering method is preferable since sticking jet vanes into the rocket exhaust reduces the thrust by a couple percent. Instead, the thrust of these auxiliary engines adds to the overall thrust of the first stage.

The analysis states that each of these steering engines provides 3 tons of thrust in addition to the 27 tons of thrust from each of the Nodong engines, giving a total thrust of 120 tons for the first stage. The analysis does not indicate what the "3-ton" figure is based on, but it seems too high for several reasons.

These engines appear to be very similar to the steering engines of the Soviet SSN-6 missile, and one possibility people have discussed is that North Korea and Iran obtained or copied the SSN-6 vernier engines. However, the SSN-6 used two of these engines for steering and they had a combined thrust of 3 tons, or 1.5 tons each.

Moreover, the SSN-6 engines were fueled with more advanced propellant (UDMH + NTO). In the Unha these steering engines instead use the kerosene + RFNA propellant combination used in the main engines. That would seem to drop the thrust below 1.5 tons.

One interesting question is whether the North Korean steering engines are able to use UDMH + NTO as well as kerosene + RFNA, since UDMH + NTO is the propellant frequently assumed to be used in the Unha third stage and the Iranian Safir second stage. If the North Korean engines can't, then we need to rethink the propellant and performance of those stages.

In addition, Markus Schiller and Robert Schmucker looked at the diagrams in the analysis and saw another problem with assuming these engines each provide 3 tons of thrust. As Markus wrote in an email:

"According to the flow chart, the fuel for the verniers is diverted after the regulator. The regulator itself looks exactly like the standard Nodong/Shahab 3 engine's fuel flow regulator. With the claimed 3 tons of vernier thrust, this would mean a diversion of 11% of the fuel flow. This seems a little too much to work without adjustments. However, for a vernier with less thrust, this might work.

"Also, if you have your Nodong engines running with standard mass flow, plus an additional 10 or 11% flow for the vernier engines, you would need 10% more propellant in the first stage to get the generally accepted 120 s of burn time. This would be 6 extra tons of propellant mass, and with that, it gets difficult to fit the propellants into the given tank volumes."

For these reasons, it seems likely that the thrust of the steering engines is well below 3 tons each, and likely less than 1.5 tons each. It's true that the thrust increases from the sea-level value as the rocket goes to higher altitude, but if the sea-level thrust was 1.5 tons it would only increase by about 20% to 1.8 tons as the rocket reached higher altitudes (see details below).

So the engines would add perhaps 5% to the thrust of the Nodong engines, assuming their presence doesn't reduce the performance of the main engines. That appears to be 5 to 6% lower than the South Korean team assumed.

The second interesting result of the assessment is that a number of parts were purchased from abroad, especially various sensors and some of the electronics, which it notes are commercially available products. These were apparently identified by markings, etc. The assessment then states that it presumes the other parts of the missile were made by North Korea.

The most interesting question is whether or not the Nodong engines were built by North Korea. It would be nice to know more about the South Korean panel's thinking on this. The absence of clear evidence that the Nodong engines were made elsewh ere does not convince me that they were made in North Korea, although that is certainly possible. There is ongoing debate about whether North Korea bought these engines from Russia, bought production equipment and built them in North Korea, or reverse engineered them and built them in North Korea. I don't see this analysis as shedding much light on this question.

After looking at the photos in the summary, Markus wrote:

"The main engines were manufactured in the typical Russian way, with the well-known soldered corrugated metal sheet design. This is the design that Iraq never successfully managed to implement, even though they tried hard. It is quite a demanding manufacturing process, and this does not really add up with the poor production quality of the tank."

This doesn't prove anything, of course. North Korea may have had considerable technical assistance in learning to build Nodong engines and may have applied quality control in that production process at a level they didn't bother to apply to constructing the propellant tanks, which are said to show uneven welds and crude workmanship.

So if the South Korean analysts have concluded that the Nodong engines, turbo pumps, etc. are in fact built in North Korea it would be interesting to hear more of their thinking.

Two other interesting things in the analysis: The first stage has two antennas, called "flight termination antennas" in the analysis. People have wondered whether North Korea's could terminate a rocket that started going haywire after launch, and this suggests they have that ability—at least with the first stage.

The rocket also has "acceleration" and "braking" motors that are used for stage separation. Six acceleration motors on the interstage section between stages 1 and 2 are used to boost stage 2, while four braking motors on stage 1 slow it slightly. This causes the two stages to separate enough that they do not run into each other.

The South Korean analysis and especially the photos are very interesting. Hopefully more details will eventually become public.
Some details on the auxiliary engines:

The figure below compares the picture of the auxiliary engines from the South Korean report (left) to similar small engines displayed by Iran (right). If they are being used for an upper stage, like the Unha third stage or the Safir third stage, the nozzles of these engines are extended (as shown in the center) to work better at high altitude. The debris  clearly shows the nozzles are not extended, and they appear to have a nozzle diameter of about 20 cm.


Figure 2. The vernier engines from the Unha (left) and those displayed by Iran (right). The red line on the right shows how much the nozzle in the center picture has been extended. (Source for Iranian engine photos: http://www.b14643.de/Spacerockets_1/Rest_World/Safir-1-IRILV/Gallery/4D10_1big.jpg)

The increase in engine thrust in going from sea level to high altitude is roughly the nozzle area times the change in atmospheric pressure. In this case, this gives an increase of about 0.3 tons of thrust for each auxiliary engine, which is about a 20% increase if the sea level thrust is 1.5 tons.

[Salo]

И сам документ:
http://www.ucsusa.org/assets/documents/nwgs/SK-report-on-NK-rocket-debris-analysis-translation-1-18-13.pdf

[Старый]

Рулевые камеры - это занятно. А мне показалось что там газовые рули...
А в ПГС двигателя почему нет ГГ?

[Старый]

Противоколебательные перегородки они обозвали силовыми элементами к тому ж L-образными хотя там ясно видно что они П-образные.